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Missing commands

  • Are there intentions to develop the missing BASIC 10 commands? Lots of commands are missing, like the collision command. The command itself is present, but there is no function behind.

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    Ultimate64, TAPunio, SD2IEC, ZX Spectrum 48k, 1581 Replik, C64 Laptop, C64 MK II, C116,
    MiSTer FPGA, TI99/4A mit PEB, Atari 800 XL, Anycubic I3 Mega, Mega65, C64 Modular, Uniprom64

  • This is a topic that is stil under constant discussions outside and inside of our team.


    tbh, it does not have a high priority on our to-do list as well and those are the main reasons:


    - certain missing commands are for comfort, but do not restrict you from achieving the desired goal.

    For the collision command i.e. you still could use the standard PEEK to check for collision. the SPRDEF command, we are currently building a new sprite editor, which supports also the MEGA65 VIC-IV sprites. so even with some "missing" commands, you are still able to achieve every possible goal you're aiming for in C65s BASIC 10 (just have a look at the original C65 demo. completely written in BASIC 10)

    so if i would give my analysis for the C65s BASIC 10 i would say Commodore implemented all the commands that are neccessarry to control the new C65 features, but did not finish on the "comfort" commands.


    -we do have the right to distribute the official C65 ROM with every machine we sell (not the emulator) but this does not include manipulation of this ROM, so a "patch" like this, i.e. for BASIC would be needed to be seperately applied to the ROM (That's how we do it atm.) but we could not give out the machine with an already "tinkered" C65 ROM.


    - BASIC 10 is an outdated BASIC. It would be nice for the "Retro" point of view and charme , to see those missing commands implemented, but we think, it would be quite more convinient to have a properly built BASIC, included in the Open-ROM.


    But nevertheless, we would be more than happy, if somebody would go ahead and start tinkering with the BASIC ROM, we would support those person(s) in every possible way.


    i do know, that this thread might call up for discussions again, but at this time, the MEGA65 team has other tasks with alot higher priorities and whoever thinks, "THE BASIC MUST BE COMPLETED" is hereby heartly invited to do it ;-) (Please let me know, when the patch is available :-D )

  • Having done a lot of work in BASIC10 both on the original C65 and the M65 I can only concur: The time & knowledge & energy needed to complete BASIC10 would be better invested in a fresh start & creating a BASIC implementation that’s actually worthy of this machine.


    Don’t get me wrong, BASIC10 is nice to tinker around and hack your way through the machine (akin to what BASIC2 was to the C64) , and that is in itself immensely enjoyable, but it’s hopelessly outdated, slow and convoluted.


    I mean, no integer arithmetic (and thus always burning precious cpu time), no named functions and procedures, only 2 significant letters as variable identifiers... come on, this was archaic 25 years ago.


    Completing the missing commands won’t make it a better language.


    (just my 2ct of course)

  • Thank you very much for the answers. I have already realised the collision command in the way you proposed. I have wondered as I tried out some commands. It would be very nice, if sometimes all commands would work. That makes the development of the machine complete.

    ___________________________________________________________________________
    Ultimate64, TAPunio, SD2IEC, ZX Spectrum 48k, 1581 Replik, C64 Laptop, C64 MK II, C116,
    MiSTer FPGA, TI99/4A mit PEB, Atari 800 XL, Anycubic I3 Mega, Mega65, C64 Modular, Uniprom64

  • Are there intentions to develop the missing BASIC 10 commands?

    That's a goal of mine, at least in the long term. Family, kids and so ... ;)


    I've been dealing with the C65 ROM for a while and digging into it and going deeper and deeper. :syshack: I would also think it would be nice if the BASIC 10, as it was planned by Commodore at this time, also got a "worthy completion". That is my very personal motivation for the C65. :)


    Creating a completely different BASIC native for the MEGA65 I'll see rather skeptical. Personally, I would miss the "historical" background.


    Here it makes more sense for me to either adapt an existing BASIC compiler to the MEGA65 or to write one specifically for the MEGA65. However, the whole thing for the PC / Mac and the code generated with it is then executed on the MEGA65. But it's just my personal opinion. :whistling:

  • Snoopy You're my star.

    believe me, if we ever get our hands on the last official C65 ROM 911204 from Fred Bowen, you'll be the first who'll receive a copy !!!

    Our whole team is amazed, what you have found out since you started digging.

    I believe within the last couple of years more information about the C65 came back to daylight than the last 20-something years before and alot of this information came from you.

    Thanks !